You know, I am not a pacficist…

Posted: October 20, 2009 in Humans, Sex Work, WTF???

Also, how often are you going to be on a thread where me, Faith and Polly agree in something?

Yet, it seems we are when it comes to some male asshole named Andrew, right here, in the comments

See, I am grumpy.  I just got up, after a night of not sleeping (however, I did catch up on heroes and supernatural- always a win) and I am heading out with Vladimir here shortly- also a win, but before I go I am going to discuss the huge fail that is apparently named Andrew. 

Here we have a guy, who apparently watches porn, yet decides to go on over to ND’s blog and tell women how they can stop themselves from getting raped (because you know, none of that shit is on rapists), how damaged people in the sex industry are and spout some Farley stats (yet he watches porn???) and how strippers/sex workers just make bad decisions when it comes to the men they choose (because they’ve all suffered from abuse) and how they are just so incredibly likely to be horrible, horrible parents. 

I mean, here I go with that infamous violence and all, but shit if I do not want to place a size six steel-toed boot firmly against this guy’s skull- perhaps repeatedly.  Who knows, it might jar something loose and allow some actual wisdom to sink in! 

One, unless a woman is a rapist, rape does not fall on her.  It is not her fault.  I do not care is she is drunk, dancing half naked on a bar and masturbating in front of an entire fraternity.  Unless she consents to have sex with whomever, it is rape, and nothing she did makes someone else rape her.  Women and their behavior, no matter what it is, cannot make a man rape them.  Women, unless were imagining some gal with the a gun to the head of a man, safety off and trigger cocked, cannot make men rape other women.  Even then, dude could choose to take the bullet.  The onus to prevent rape is not on women, and how they dress, or where they go, or if they drink, or any of that shit.  It is on men.  You know, to not rape them even if they are passed out intoxicated and naked, and on them to prevent other men from doing so.  Sleazy clothing is not an invite/excuse to rape.  Wrong place  wrong time is not an invite/excuse to rape.  Drinking is not an invite/excuse to rape.  In fact, there is no invite/excuse to rape.  Rape is a decision made by a rapist, and the fault of that rapist alone.  No One Makes Them Do It.  Pretty fucking basic.

Secondly….ffs…gee, my mom wasn’t a sex worker or stripper or whatever.  Two parent family and everything.  I was not a victim of CSA, or any other kind of sexual abuse/ assault for that matter…yet oddly enough, I still got into the sex biz.  I also managed to get two college degrees, am in the midst of preparing for a new day job, managed to marry a pretty decent guy, and all that other stuff.  I’d like to think that I would raise kids to be strong, independent people capable of critical thought, artistic skill and appreciation, who would, oh, grow up to be decent citizens.  Like a whole lot of other people, no matter their back grounds, do.  I mean hell, I know everything from kids of strippers who grew up to be highly responsible military people to silver spoon/two family/had every advantage people who grew up to be crackheads.  In fact, I have to say, for the most part amid the humans I’ve encountered, the people who have had some strife or oddity in their lives- rough childhoods, family tragedies like the death of a parent, some poverty issues, yep, even folk who were abused, have grown up to be in many ways better people, stronger, hard working, more compasionate, more critically thinking, more appreciative of the good things people than folk I have known who came from “perfect, American Dream, two family, normal” households.  Strife can build some character, y’all.  It can remind one of what is really important and all. 

And the bad choices argument puts me over the edge.  It seems that a lot of people, regardless of profession and upbringing, make some bad choices in mates.  Men and Women alike.  Hell, the divorce rate is what, like 50%?  Same goes for childrearing.  Whether it be the young woman seeking validation and love who hooks up with the slick player or the White Knight who hooks up with the gold-digger-people, in all different walks of life and professions- make bad choices sometimes.  I do not believe this is more common amid strippers than it is amid anyone else.  In fact, if anything, I think sex workers are more leary of men who promise the world and deliever nothing than women who aren’t.  They can be, especially if they are seasoned vets and not wide-eyed kids, far more critical and demanding and discerning in long time partners than regular folk are.  Hell, they know what men can be like away from their wives and children.  Shrug.  Case in point:  Of the married sex workers I know and whose lives I know about…the married ones?  Still married and whatnot.  Amid the non sex worker folk I know?  Several divorces and utter train wreck break ups.  Hence, my thinking Andrew there is full of shit. 

Now granted, I do not know Andrew personally.  I have no idea if he has been abused, or screwed over by a woman, or what sort of background he comes from.  Those things might explain a lot.  However, what I see is some entitled asshat going on to a womans blog and telling women how they need to do things, how the world is, and making a shit load of assumptions about women he knows nothing about.  Which yep, inspires boot/head feelings.  Tell ya what Andrew, you keep on keeping on- you make for a great example of an asshole man.  As for rape prevention, I will continue to advocate this:  women, if a man tries to rape you- shoot him.  Empty the clip, just to make sure.  That way, no woman will ever “make” him rape anyone ever again.  Because you know, if Andrew and men like him are right, well, the men just cannot control themselves and need to be put down like rabid dogs. 

Gods some people are morons.   

  1. Nine Deuce says:

    <em As for rape prevention, I will continue to advocate this: women, if a man tries to rape you- shoot him. Empty the clip, just to make sure. That way, no woman will ever “make” him rape anyone ever again. Because you know, if Andrew and men like him are right, well, the men just cannot control themselves and need to be put down like rabid dogs.

    Sounds good to me.

    Andrew is indeed clueless. I’ve gotten quite tired of his antics on this one.

    • ginmar says:

      Wellllllllllllllll…the problem is, women don’t get believed now as it is. If they shoot some guy before he rapes them—-because that’s the goal—what’s going to happen then?

      I think the best place to start is to fight myths about rape, sexism, and be a real bitch about it. A Renegade, if you will. 🙂 Slap down all that shit repeatedly, and often. Get the message across: I believe women. Why don’t you? At least as much as men, whose lies get believed. Women who tell the truth get called liars.

  2. Nine Deuce says:

    Fuck, will you please fix my tags? I forgot the .

  3. Roy Kay says:

    Andrew’s just the guy that thinks if he ran the world – especially protecting women from themselves – it would be a lot happier a place. The gist of it seems to boil down to “What all women need is a good father in their lives.” He kind of gets to be a Paternalist Against The Patriarchy this way.

  4. Yeah, as a survivor of CSA and all, I am disgusted by some of his comments.

  5. Ian says:

    Tue, but the other side is getting wrecked and making it with somebody you fancy that you regret in the morning or you’re afraid the boys will call you a ‘slut’ and the girls a ‘sex object’ isn’t rape either. Laughing at a male as a ‘pussy’ and ‘wimp’ and a ‘poof’ because he took ‘No’ to mean ‘No’ and bragging about the ‘real man’ who takes command is just ‘social rape’. In a sadder way, so is feeling that you must have let a man down because you couldn’t screw him and not understanding that if all he cared about was getting his rocks off more than your pleasure and how you enjoy making love together for each other no matter how you do it, then you are wanting him to look on you as a masturbatory machine and condemning him for not being a rapist only concerned with his prick. I had that after what was otherwise a lovely time with a friend a year ago – but she could not accept that being unable to have intercourse did not bother me. She wanted me to look on her as selfishly as a rapist and hated me for not doing so. Sad.

  6. Stone Fox says:

    i’m sorry, i could only stomach so much. this guy falls squarely under the heading of Too Fucking Stupid And Arrogant to Live.

    i know i joke about my own ignorance being no excuse to keep my opinion to myself, but seriously. the fucked up generalizations this guy is making.. it just defies logic.

  7. Ernest Greene says:

    There’s a kind of morbid fascination to it. It’s hard not to look.

  8. Ian says:

    It’s all arse over tit. If you cut the in-between situations and the everybody-drunk-at-a-party out, you come to a situation that the less a woman is expected to make her own sexual decisions, the less she has to do to be seen making a sexual invitation she can’t refuse. She can only really say No when she can ‘really’ say Yes without being judged for it. The more prudery, the more rape. The more it’s accepted that women are free to have sex when they want to, the more evident the times when they don’t want to.

    Putting the emphasis on avoiding unwanted sex still makes the assumption that it’s the men who always want sex and the women who always don’t, so if a woman acts sexually then it must be a come-on and any refusal is just for show. The emphasis needs (still!) to be the other way round, to make it quite clear that it is perfectly normal for a woman to enjoy sex in her own right, not as a ‘gift’, and therefore if she isn’t interested it’s not because she feels under social pressure that needs him to get her out of responsibility, it’s because she just doesn’t feel like it.

    Feminists have often been as bad or worse than conservatives in giving the impression that no normal woman ever wants to “degrade herself to men’s lusts” or ever has ‘lusts’ of her own. Not that they started out that way. The simple fact is that the moment you respect sex and stop treating it as something men do for men to women, you start to respect sexual women and to respect women’s choice not to be sexual. In the end it isn’t so much a matter of men not respecting women as of both sexes often not respecting sex itself, so it becomes something no ‘nice girl’ should admit to – and who cares about girls who aren’t ‘nice’?

    If you want to get raped, go to Saudi Arabia – if you report it the police might rape you too. If you want to feel safe, go to Amsterdam or Copenhagen where nobody gives a shit about a woman’s sex life so she can strip off and dance on the table without every jackass treating her like free beer just for him.

    If ‘the sex industry’ is full of sleazebags that’s because sex is seen as sleazy and borderline legal. There’s a direct comparison with gambling or booze: where it’s criminalised, surprise surprise, it attracts criminals. Where it isn’t it may well still inherit criminal elements from its old days but the ones it attracts are no different from the same protectionists and extortionists that hover round every industry.

    Sweden has gone mad with Britain set to follow on the assumption that unless proven otherwise all prostitutes are probably trafficked sex slaves and prosecuting clients for collusion in the trafficking. How much easier to have prostitution out in the open where there the trafficked slaves will be the ones hidden away that can’t show their face in the legal world and therefore that much more obvious to detect and protect while the ‘working girls’ are free to run their show.

  9. rachel cervantes says:

    Oh, lawsy, I think I”m fixing to get myself run out of town on a rail after a tar-and-feather party. I agreed, in part, with Andrew. You see, I DO think rape of a child is worse than any other kind of rape. ALL rape is horrific, but rape of a child? I can’t even begin to….my mind….the horror….a CHILD?

    The thing is, I see a crime of any kind when the vic is a child as worse than when perpetrated on any other victim. I don’t care WHAT the crime is. When a child is the vic, it’s worse.

    Ok, ready…aim…fire! Go for it folks…I can take it. But I warn you, I might …. sniff….sniffle…cry! (But remember: “many a truth” found “in jest.”)

  10. Ian says:

    I hope Rachel’s comment did not arise from anything I said because as long as by ‘child’ we mean physically pre-sexual and ‘rape’ unwanted forcible sex, then if there is any possible contender it is the insanity of forcing sex on the other end of the age spectrum, the geriatric and possibly mentally incompetent. We can provide ‘extenuating circumstances’ for ‘technical rape’ when we really mean sexually active teenagers looking for it under the legal age (probably 90% of women I’ve met lost their virginity before legally allowed to, with boys of similar age – sometimes I’d call it ‘as good as’ rape though they wouldn’t, other times they were more in charge). But we can’t provide any excuses of ‘misunderstanding’, ‘cold feet’ or anything of the sort with what really is a ‘sex object’, that is might as well be a doll or an animal with no possible sexuality of its own and nothing ‘sexual’ about it or any sign of enjoying the ‘process’.

    It’s possible to cook up all sorts of allowances for a ‘Roman Polanski situation’ or for mental defectives with the mind of a loving child but the instincts of a sexual adult, but when it comes to forcing sex on ‘real’ immature children well below the age of puberty, no extenuating circumstances apply. Making love with an adult willing woman can be painful – how the hell that sub-human filth doing what no normal animal ever would can even manage it is beyond me!

    Here is a thought: how many rapists and especially child rapists, are circumcised? I have no idea but I have a suspicion that reducing male sensitivity with circumcision makes it a lot easier to hurt whomever he puts it into without being hurt himself.

  11. rachel cervantes says:

    My response was more because I’m sympathetic to Andrew’s horror at the victimization of children. You see, while he expressed some attitudes based on erroneous stereotypes and has some societally sanctioned biases, reading the comments I really thought looked like he allowed himself to be pushed into making some extreme statements. Have you ever found yourself saying things you don’t really believe because you let yourself be backed into a corner?

    I think Andrew is quite possibly educable. I could be wrong.

    Oh, erm…hold everything. I just realized I had gotten distracted before I got to read the thread to the end. Hang on while I go see if I have my head up my…armpit.

  12. rachel cervantes says:

    i take it back. He’s an idiot.

  13. I’m not quite sure how to think about Andrew. Sometimes, he’s got at least half of a decent point, which is more than I can manage on a bad day. Other times… yeah.

  14. Ian says:

    It’s important to remember that opinions and names are individual – I’ve found far more pro-female from men and far more support for ‘traditional misogyny’ among women using the name ‘feminist’ than anywhere else.

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